A Little Tease

Above you’ll find a little tease of what’s coming down the pipe. Can you spot what’s significant in this screenshot (Hint check the image url)?

Click the image to see full size…

56 Responses to “A Little Tease”


  1. Timo Gufler

    Great to see that things are progressing! Still, I would like to file a bug report right way. The version dialog shows a different version than the image url. ;) Frankly, thanks for keeping us up to date!

  2. ZATZAi

    Hehe, I know. I find that a little weird too. It’ll all get sorted out before it goes public “full release” though.

  3. Corax Hellman

    i love imprudence, the simple and elegant interface the user friendly windows, the chat window that has contacts, groups, local chat and instant messages in the same window just separated by tabs, and the fast loading of the graphics.

    i’ve been using imprudence for a long long time and i love everything about it, yes i know i’m missing out the new features like mesh, shadows, physics, outfits etc i also know that as a mac user i’m missing the media . but all that is worth it .

    please don’t make the same mistake as firestorm or viewer2.

    1- Inventory window, its perfect as it is just 3 buttons all part of the inventory, (All items, Recent and Worn) , when you search for something in your inventory in the all items tab and then you click the recent tab, whatever you typed in the other tab it stays there, and you are able to have a different item search in each tab. if you want to add the outfits feature a 4th button in the inventory tab would be perfect. don’t change that

    2- Communicate Window, the reason i’m loyal to Imprudence, what could be better than having all your communication in the same window : NOTHING, contacts, groups, local chat ,group chat, and instant message belong in the same window don’t make the same mistake than the others and separate local chat, contacts and groups.

    3- buttons and interface, first of all the text box of local chat, its perfect as it is, you can have it there all the time or you can hide it, there’s no need to expand it to see what was said, thats why the local chat window is there!!!, and about the rest of the buttons like snapshot, search, build, map, mini-map, inventory, talk, etc yes they could be a little smaller (even the icons instead of names works).

    to sum it all the Kokua-Imprudence viewer 1.4.0 still is the best viewer for Second Life, it’s good to look forward to the next version that i’m sure it will also rock hard.

    greetings to all the developers and programers of the Kokua-Imprudence team and all the users. keep rocking hard!

  4. pierrottin

    i totally agree with Corax…i’m a big fan of imprudence 1.4 interface
    please keep kokua the same look and feel…or leave it

  5. Tahuti MortmagusII

    Oh no, it’s a v3 interface. The very reason I stuck to Phoenix on SL. Phoenix and Firestorm tend to have incompatibilities over on Inworldz, they work, but, there are many issues hence I use Imprudence on IW. Suspect that with this interface and coding Kokua will go the same way as far as IW is concerned so will not be migrating to it for OS grids.

  6. Greybeard Thinker

    Sorry crew, but this Imp lover won’t be moving onto Kokua while LL calls the shots. I’m a dedicated OpenSim user and do NOT like anything about SL\LL, and don’t want any of their influence in my VR experience.
    I’ll stick to Impy 1.4 beta 2 and to hell with even mesh If I have to.
    Yep, this has got my neck fur up.

    Onefang? work work work old mate, see if you can add mesh to Impy 1.4 and we’ll shower you with praise for ever more.

  7. onefang

    Actually, I just want to get 1.4 out with known bugs fixed. It’s been delayed long enough, and adding mesh will just mean a lot longer delay while all the new bugs from major new code are sorted out. That’s why I’m concentrating on what’s in the issue tracker for 1.4 beta 3.

    I do intend to add mesh (and other nice things) to Imprudence 1.5.

  8. Tahuti MortmagusII

    Oh, that’s good news, descriptions not updating in Search is a little frustrating :)

  9. Andre

    different subject: is Aurora-Sim still being maintained? can’t get it to work as standalone. see http://is.gd/XAZjWi for forum post.

    thanks

  10. Betty Jeffers

    I have seen mesh. It’s frankly much ado about nothing. From those same people who brought us great advances like Display Names. Voice Morphing. Viewer 2, 2.5 , 3. & Linden Realms. Greybeard is absolutely right. According to the Phoenix Folks they have the majority of the SL viewer Market. After Linden Viewers in second and Singularity we are in the “other” catagory. Purple is nary a blip on the bell curve. I did not leave anything behind in SL, so I do not intend to go back. Greybeard is correct, lets forget what Lindens want and press on with an official Open Sim viewer.

  11. Tahuti MortmagusII

    Mesh was developed as 3D rendering outside SL. Blender had it before LL implemented it. It’s OK, if used wisely it can cut down on prim count. Used unwisely a single prim contorted object can end up being counted at around 120 prims land impact.

  12. Greybeard Thinker

    @Onefang,

    Sits on edge of seat awaiting Impy 1.5

    @Andre,
    Yes, but at a slower pace now the head dev is attending college.

    @Betty,
    TY for the kind words.

  13. ChrysFox

    …sits on chair next to Greybeard, hoping a little something might arrive for us mac users, too.
    Thankies for keeping the Imp alive.

  14. onefang

    I’ve recently worked on a couple of Mac specific fixes, and someone that actually can compile on a Mac is testing them out for me. Need more of that sort of tester. Still need a proper Mac developer for Impy and Kokua though. Any volunteers?

  15. Andre

    To: Betty

    ok thanks, i will keep an eye on the Aurora website for changes…

  16. Xia Xue

    “I have seen mesh. It’s frankly much ado about nothing.”
    but have you SEEN mesh? it actually responds to local lighting (the prim doesn’t light up differently than the av). why’s this something? prim feet? any other bits that need to tint with your skin?
    no knee/ankle joints in boots? no elbow joints in coats? full-length dresses that don’t give you a giant butt?

    yeah, mesh totally sucks

  17. Greybeard Thinker

    @Xia Xue
    quote “I have seen mesh. It’s frankly much ado about nothing.”

    Erm, yes actually, and in the main part totally agree with you.
    Personally I think meshes are somewhat over-rated.
    With lousy LOD unless heavily worked on, heavy prim count unless well crafted and tweaked, hard to build, even harder to texture well, and not easy to use in world for much other than decorative things right now.

    However, there are many who think Mesh is some kind of magic thing, and to view mesh Avatars and objects in our favourite viewer (Impy) would be a nice touch.

    As Onefang said however, he has more pressing bug fixes to release first, and I for one think that is a good thing and will look forward to testing them, and wait in hope of seeing at least mesh rendering in a new version of Imp in the not too distant future.

  18. Geek4Linux

    I won’t be using any viewer that resembles Linden Labs SL V2, I use Opensim and am not at all interested in Second Life, if you make Imprudence look and work like V2 then I won’t be updating.

  19. clebber

    Great work.. keep pushing forwards and ignore anybody whining about the fact it’s not a V1 ui… It’s time people let V1 go, it’s dead!

  20. xia xue

    for building, yes… mesh is VERY much overrated. you can typically do the same exact builds with a sculpt for FAR less prims (not to mention far less “explode everybody’s GPU”). for building, mesh doesn’t really exist as far as i can tell. but i never really thought LL was targeting it for building; they knew the prim counts on it would be massive. not to mention their demo videos all focused on avatar creation via rigging.

  21. kopilo hallard

    I’m not seeing anything in the preview which isn’t in slv3 already. Not really a tease at all.

  22. Betty Jeffers

    If I offended Mesh fans, I apologise. But for me… it was rubish. I bought some mesh clothes. I could not adjust them. I was told to adjust my shape to fit the clothes. Is that practical? what if I want two mesh items? Will I have to compromise to two ill fitting items? Unlike open sim.. In SL I am now being told what to look like..Told what features as a user I am allowed to keep. I have the feeling in my increasingly rare visits to SL I have crossed the Iorn Curtain into a place where the Kommisars are dictating my choices. Lets once and for all finally bid farewell to Linden Labs and concentrate on Open Sim. Don’t waste our time porting over Linden’s latest flawed shiney that usually just breaks our favorite things.

  23. Revel Peters

    mesh is optional but as someone who likes cool objects etc and enjoys using mesh it will only enhance my experience to have the option to create items in mesh. I am puzzled by the way people view mesh as “evil” or “useless”. To those that enjoy making mesh objects and adding them to their builds etc they are great. I am enjoying the added abilities to use mesh. The other options are still available and wont go away. So for me its not a shiney or just about linden labs. The platform is for more then one use and since I have managed to find viewers that let me add mesh I am using it. Its only useless to someone who doesn’t want to use it. Its useful to those of us who do use it. It will like npcs and other features only enrich and broaden the uses of opensim. It sadens me to see people who are angry because they are creating a viewer that lets you see things created in mesh lol.

  24. Nicky Perian

    @Betty,

    I agree that mesh is a mess with instabilities some of which come from the multiple applications feeding into mesh objects.

    However, it is a new technology that generates much user interest and that is why I wanted to get to users as soon as possible.

    I recently posted a new kokua development installer that has kokua branding and colors. The functionally is still very much LL’s v3 but I expect that will change soon as other developers complete their work.
    http://wiki.kokuaviewer.org/wiki/Kokua:Experimental#Kokua:Release_Notes.2F3.3.1_Alpha

    The kokua mesh implementation was obtained for the Firestorm project with a few added hacd library tweaks. It is an opensource implementation of linden lab mesh upload.

    I have tested it on LL’s aditi grid, osgrid and my localhost diva grid. Opensim is at least 2/3′s of my testing effort.

  25. Inara Pey

    @Betty Jeffers

    Mesh is still developing – on SL and on OpenSim (which has adopted the same approach to rendering mesh). Clothing is a issue, but many designers have found a way to deal with it using Alpha Layers to circumvent sizing issues (and I won’t mention the developing parametric deformer here – but which is also being developed as much for OS as SL).

    @xia xue

    Mesh is being used within SL for building with good effect. What tends to be the problem is the time and effort that needs to be invested in mesh to achieve an outcome. While I agree it is easier to achieve specific requirements through sculpts (I generate and use them myself), they can place a much heavier rendering load on the system than either prims or mesh – hence the time it takes for sculpts to render or “pop-out” at you when you log-in / teleport somewhere.

    A much better option for building is to use the convex hull physics shape that mesh has made available.

    When used on prims / linksets made from basic prim forms – cubes, cylinder, spheres, and providing you do not include scripted prims in a linkset, you can reduce the land impact of a prim build by up to 50% simply by converting the physics form. This again reflects the fact that basic prim shapes have much less in the way of impact on downloading / rendering.

    I’ve used the latter option to great effect, wherein the prim-based structures of my builds can be dramatically reduced, and the use of the convex hull physics shape hopefully “compensates”, as it were, the heavier load placed on server / viewer in handling the sculpts that I do use.

  26. xia xue

    “I bought some mesh clothes. I could not adjust them. I was told to adjust my shape to fit the clothes. Is that practical? what if I want two mesh items? Will I have to compromise to two ill fitting items?”

    well, you COULD always use a viewer that’s capable of ‘add’ing clothes layers so you can wear the proper alphas that most mesh comes with. more and more now, as well, mesh clothes are boxed in a number of sizes (i just bought a dress that has 5 distinctly different sizes). things simply needed a little bit of time to figure out HOW it works out. sculpts weren’t so hot at first either, remember? everybody said it would never work, nobody would ever want sculpts? now look… you have a hard time buying anything *without* sculpts.
    as for changing your body-shape to fit mesh, it’s not typically much more than adjusting ‘bodyfat’ sliders. THAT’S not even needed with the newer outfits that are packaged in multiple sizes. if it’s mesh that’s rigged to the skeleton well, there’s only a very few sliders to change your av to fit with it. and it’s not like ALL clothes don’t need some balance of “shape attachment” tweaking to fit it. even if you’re using basic-prims from 2006, what fits on one person won’t necessarily fit on anybody else. the “change your shape to fit this” is a rather ancient issue ;P everybody just seemed to think mesh would be miracle-fitting magical attachments, despite it being rather obvious the ‘soft’ and ‘hard’ parts of the av are 2 totally separate things. the only plausible way to make mesh fit the ‘soft’ parts of the av (breast, bodyfat, muscle, etc etc): make it built-in to the viewer, downloaded with the app. and THAT takes ‘user creation’ out of the pic entirely. would losing the power of user-creation be *better* than just tweaking your shape a little bit for ONE outfit?

  27. Tahuti MortmagusII

    Then of course you could always copy the shape, add the copy to the outfit folder that contains the mesh attachments, adjust the copied shape and hey presto no more need to adjust it for that folder containing mesh any more.

    Of course there will be the occasional issue of wanting to add some mesh clothing to a shape that you don’t normally add that clothing to and haven’t prepared an alternative shape, but, nothing is perfect on SL which means we sometimes need a click or two more than usual :)

  28. Crim

    The mesh clothes issue will be fixed to a great degree when LL finally gets parametric mesh working. That actually does conform to the shape rather than the skeleton.

  29. fabrixx

    any news??

  30. fabrixx

    Sorry why have censored me?
    I love imprudence

  31. Lestat

    This is exactly the reason, as a designer, I left sl V2. After using a interface for 5 years that was totally re-hauled overnight I was on a frantic search, which brought me to Imp…no mesh, interface change, I’m sorry I will not be coming back :( I loved Imp

  32. Walter Balazic

    I’m with Greybeard on this one honestly. Sound was important to us so we bounce back and forth from Imp to Firestorm (because firestorm has an almost perfect v1.x interface now). Imp’s interface is fantastic the way it is!! I know everyone thinks v3 is all that, but based on what I see with Firestorm, you can have a good ol’ v1.x interface using v3.x features. I hope Imp stays with the v1.x interface and I know alot of us feel the same way.. fixing audio and cache would be nice though.. ;)

  33. Gaga

    I am all for more focus on Opensim that’s why I have pushed and pushed for the grid list feature to be rebuilt to incorporate a grid search function that calls on a database grid owners can submit grid info to. Armin has been working on this and there is a test viewer, Teapot. I have been blogging about it here…

    http://metaverse-traveller.blogspot.co.uk/

    Teapot is Armin’s personal test viewer which is built on LL v3.3 code. I prefer Impy of course so I hope the feature can be ported back to it once Armin has developed it but if it has to be Kokua then I guess I have to go with it.

    Regardless of all that Armin has commented on my blog that he believes, quote “I absolutely think it would be a prudent goal for opensim to have active support for a viewer project that is (as) independent (as possible) from SL roots.”

    Regarding Aurora sim I became very disillusioned with it after Revolution Smythe became scarce. There were a lot of problems to be solved, as far as I could see the project had become too ambitious given that Rev knew he would be going to collage in September. I know some of the team still work on it and Rev does when he can but it seems to me all the steam has gone out of it – and some of the promise.

    I still have hope for Aurora though but at least Opensim plods on getting slowly (very slowly) better.

    Gaga

  34. Gaga

    OMG! I just thought of the Aesop’s Fables “The Hare and the Tortoise” Aurora is the Hare that raced off leaving the Tortoise (Opensim) plodding slowly along. So then Rev left for collage and the Hare fell asleep. Meanwhile the Tortoise finally caught up and passed the Hare by.

    *chuckles some*

  35. Shigeko Tachikawa

    …and while the “little tease” is nothing more than what it says, and while the tease is approaching an age of two months, the Imprudence viewer has been marked with a big warning sign in the Third Party Viewer directory.

    Just saying’

  36. onefang

    @Shigeko Tachikawa: That big warning sign has been there for a long time. It’s just saying Imprudence is a bit behind in some important features like mesh and multiple attachments. We do plan to add those features, but first have to get a stable release out (coming soon).

    Note that Imprudence is at the top of the list, meaning that according to LL’s statistics, it’s more stable than the rest, even LL’s own viewer. Quality takes time.

  37. Tahuti MortmagusII

    I had never noticed Imprudence did not support multiple attachments yet, thought I’d been using them. Now you have me scratching my head :)

  38. onefang

    “Mesh Object Rendering and Multiple Attachments” is what LL says when you follow the link in that warning. I think the mean the new LL multiple attachments to one point system, which is different from the old Emerald system that did something similar, and different yet again to just wearing multiple attachments, but only one per attachment point.

    Clear as mud?

  39. freeballer

    Any news when this will be released? I always liked imprudence over the other viewers. But not if it doesn’t support multiple attachments and mesh. Please hurry!

  40. Betty Jeffers

    *wimpers* Linden Labs, Lindens, Second Life…. Second Life Third party viewers list. Oh please.. If you must go there make Kokua for Lindiots grid. Why can’t Imprudence be focused on Open Sim ? My Mini Map frezes me. Some of my textures dissaper in 1.4.0, Beta, fix those bugs. Wave Bye Bye to the Lindencompoops and lets get on with an open sim viewer. I don’t care in the very least what the Lindens are doing. Their moronic innovations are what made me leave there. I do notice Singularity use increasing on open sim. I down loaded it myself. If it’s AO loaded faster ………..

  41. clebber

    ” Can you spot what’s significant in this screenshot ”

    it’s age???

    You might as well just make you viewer for opensim only as everyone on the SL grid has given up hope of ever getting another viewer out of this dead project.

  42. fabrixx

    There will be a fix for the incompatibility with fontconfig 2.9 in linux systems based on Debian?
    I have this problem only with imprudence & teapot
    Very very thanks for all job.

    http://forums.kokuaviewer.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6102

  43. fabrixx

    Imprudence 64bit fontconfig 2.8 UPDATE fix: simply unzip&copy the 2 libraries from this archive to imprudence/lib64 folder:

    http://www.sendspace.com/file/o9j130

  44. Brune BB

    In love with Imprudence… still in love, i can’t let it go, even if no mesh. There are many reasons, i think it is a very light nice viewer, i’ve tried other viewers and nothing, the most of the time crashing and bugs, we really need imprudence and i would recommend you to add the huge prim tool for builders that’s all we need… pliz pliz, pliz we really need this treasure viewer.

  45. Jean Horten

    Now, give us back the integrated local chat in the chat floater like in older Kokua versions and make all that additional info in the im/group chats ‘closeable’, and I’ll be using it every day.
    J.

  46. Andre

    when is the new version comming out allready..!! and also update the source code. Maybe create a “experimental” version so everybody is able to test and give/post feedback and suggestions.

    André

  47. makomk

    I’m pretty sure official Imprudence releases never supported any form of multiple attachments on the same point. I’ve actually been running a modified version for the past year or so (https://github.com/makomk/imprudence/tree/special-brew-6 and its predecessors) because it’s a pain not being able to view them them in some areas of SL. Unfortunately, now mesh is becoming just as important if not more so.

  48. cartan

    I think it’s fair to say the imprudence/kokula project is dead now. almost 2 years since any considerable release.

    It’s sad to say, but it will never be the viewer it once was… it’s just too far behind the game.

    RIP the purple viewer, you will be missed.

  49. Optikal

    I’ve been away from SL for near 2 years, it seems there is no new update for Imp? what happened to Kokua? Where is everyone?..

  50. Robert S

    because of this taking to long waiting times, i advertise another viewer by an old member of the developers.

    https://bitbucket.org/ArminW/teapot/downloads

    Its based on Kokua and has also Mesh.

  51. renayoy Oh

    Hi,

    thanks for imprudence 64bits, it’s simply the best viewer for ubuntu, the fastest one that never crash…

    how things go, in the dev of kokua?

  52. RL66

    hello, few ago LL have introduced havoc making SL viewer nearly incompatible with SL.

    will you support both opensim and LL grid or only opensim (well i guess you will not support only LL lol)?

    and also is there any news on the dev of kokua? last reposit is a bit old now.

  53. fabrixx

    Sorry, i’m tryng teapot but whwn i select camera control nothin appear,is possible?

  54. renayoy Oh

    your dead ??

  55. Mindy Mathy

    That’s just GREAT ! :( So, who sold out ?? If we wanted a
    UI that was identical to
    SL2, We would use SL2!
    What were you guys THINKING ????????????????

    former imprudence lover

  56. NickyP

    Here is the link to the current repository for re skinning kokua to be more imprudence like.
    https://bitbucket.org/NickyP/kokua-dev-skins
    Provide help with the re-skinning and we will review your contributions and
    include in a development build for peer review testing.